Jeremy: I Isaac Isaac you're on the podcast, bro. You're on the podcast. Oh yeah.
Isaac Feldman: You wouldn't believe like every, each episode that I was listening while working like last week, I was getting more and more hype to be the podcast
Isaac Feldman: more.
Yes. Yes. And the fact that you, that you first. Oh, you didn't you?
No, because, because you, I mean, you know, this is kind of like non-politically correct, but people know that my accounts, like my Twitter account is a little shit post date. Yeah. I know for a fact, I know for a fact that there's a lot of people in the telco space, which is like, yeah, I skipped cool and whatever, but it's the little two sheet posting and they'll see little frogs here and there.
And I'm like, I'm not into politics. I'm just, I'm just me. Right. I'm just, I just want to have fun while I'm doing what I'd like to doing, which is making stuff. But people pretend to be like big businesses. And that's funny to me.
Jeremy: Yeah, dude. It is funny to me when like all your sounds, fucking courses, get off
dude and going right back and forth to what you were saying about like you were talking right before I pressed, uh, we were talking about how everyone seems to be selling courses and shit. And it's like, dude, I'm all for selling your course. But honestly, to me, it has to be complimentary to something you've fucking built.
Right. So like, it can't just be a car. So for instance, I obviously like we built the one. And it's hard as fuck to build a fucking platform where everyone else builds an app, you know? So like, um, and I would own it. I would give a course away with the platform, right. Or like I would pay for the course and give the platform away, but I would not just [00:02:00] sell a fucking course for three.
I can't, I cannot stomach it. I can't do it. Go into why you fucking hate it too.
Isaac Feldman: And, and honestly, I'm, I'm going to, I'm going to tell you, like, I believe like I fully believe this is, this is how you win. This is how you gradish like, uh, the no code platforms team because, uh, either, uh, tools are too dumb or are too complex.
And the only way that you can find out. He's buying more stuff, meaning buying courses or buying hours of watching people on YouTube because that's burning time and your time is more valuable than money. You need to remember that shit. So, yeah. When you're doing that, you're spending either a lot of valuable time or either spending money with people, hyping you again and again, to make the do list, just like junior developers.
And you shouldn't be doing that. You should, you should be like looking at the price, looking at the product and just going forward. And there's no platform that take you from a to Z. And, you know, people are talking like for home based learning and I'm saying, let's go the next step. Let's go for like cohort, uh, like business building.
Because that's the day people want to build stuff. Like people get so lost in tools and I can make the school work workflow in this, this thing and that thing. Yeah. Make money. Does it make money? And yeah, obviously in Alaska, that's why I've been so hype. Like I listened to Europe to the, I was like, yes, yes, this is all about money.
Like 20, 21. This is my year. And I've been reelected. I been so bullish about this. I always feel bad cause I'm a designer. I'm supposed to be like art in whatever. But I'm not, I'm like a hundred percent and I've been like, Oh, you know, shout out to Y S on Twitter. He knows like yourself is he's. He's really awesome.
He's also a designer. And he's like super bullish [00:04:00] about like, you're supposed to be making money and things. And the things that you're not making money on, you should be like, stopped doing them because they're not worth it. Like,
Jeremy: no dude, even then. Because building a company or building a product is so God damn, I am difficult.
Everyone should know this. Everyone should know, it's not, you're going to launch an app or a website or a landing page, and shit's going to come to you, man. It's like, it is, you need to learn how to get your first customer and what kind of drug that is. Right. Like when I, I do to everyone remembers getting their first paid customer, everyone remembers that person.
Like that, that woman or man.
Isaac Feldman: Yeah,
Jeremy: dude, amazing feeling. How did you feel when you got your first paying customer and how did you get that?
Isaac Feldman: So, uh, my first paying customers, like as a freelancer, it was just like me scouring and looking for people, having a hard time doing these things. And I was like, I can help.
I can, because you know, always as a designer, you're always like, Oh, it's hard to talk about money, blah, blah, blah, and all that bullshit. But at the end of the day, once you realize that. You have like, you're so much value to give, and there are people in need of that value. And all they're doing is taking what's valuable, like taking some sort of value, which is money and giving it to you.
So you can give them your value because they can get it anywhere and they can get it in a bunch of places. But if you go to where they're hanging out and you present yourself and you say, look, I can give you this value. If you give me money, they'll say yes, and you'll get paid. Anything else I'm feeling so you should do
Oh, no, it is the best dude. I say, I say seeing the Stripe notification on my Apple watch better than sex. It's like, it is like the, it is a fucking high. It is a high to see if you feel that way. You're meant to do this. If you feel like it's only one, if you feel that if that crosses your mind, Get the fuck out of my face.
I'm dead serious. Like it's like, you don't have what it takes. If one is not enough to make you happy. The first one is not enough to make you happy, dude. You'll never be happy. So like, how did you go from that first customer to your next customer? Uh, just
Isaac Feldman: tasting it, you know, just like getting in Hunter mode and just go in and find it in another one, finding another one.
Sometimes there was bad, you know, some, some things work out and so you're a fund and just you move on. And, um, uh, I really, I really feel like. More people like this. I've I've been, I've been saying this to so many people in my head, like in like two people around [00:07:00] in my head, I've been writing for like a few years, an article that's called why?
Um, designers should act like a hip hop artist. Like you should, you should flex your skills. You should be flexing because if you don't do it, then somebody else going to do it and you're going to lose . Yeah, because at the end of the day, you know, uh, I was thinking about remote work for a few years and then COVID hit and then there's really no choice because you know, they're not hiring like junior developers or junior designers.
What do you do then? You just got to go and just get up and go. You just got to go find clients. Flex your skills and find somewhere somehow, you know, uh, to even not even make, make a living, but like, why did you learn all this, all this, all these things. Like, why, why are you, why, why is your designer to make pretty things?
You can be pretty things by yourself at home for free. Like you don't need [00:08:00] clients for that.
Jeremy: Yeah. Stop me. Stop taking pride in being a starving artist. Yeah, like, dude, it fucking sell your shit. Your time is valuable. Right? So like, I think entrepreneurship is an it's an art. It is not by any means of science.
Like you can take all this science and math and processes and everything. You want to throw into a pot and mix it around. But if you don't have a dash of fucking art, sorry, son. Sorry. My love, uh, your gun failed. Okay. Yeah, no, just go on, sorry. Oh, no, I was, I was finished. You can say no, I'm going
Isaac Feldman: to say, and people forget, like, because, you know, uh, especially with, with types, like, like myself, like, uh, from design background and whatnot, uh, you feel like money is not really the goal.
The goal is to impress somebody. No, but when you understand. How much skill and how much nuance it takes for somebody. See something that you design and they're like, Oh, that's cool. Let me just open my wallet. Like that is, that is such a valuable skill. That is such a, a high level skill that if you think that that's dirty or that's like, Oh, that's, that's an easy settlements chip.
You don't understand what truly design is. Oh, you don't understand like, like you don't get it. You just want to be an artist, which is fine. Do you know that Twitter is this full with artists they're selling doodles for five bucks? Like you could be a designer and, and make bank
Jeremy: correct? You do. Why would you choose to be a starving artist?
But anyway, like going back to one of the things that we were talking about, um, which is. Designing and not being cool building and WordPress when like, uh, with, with no code Twitter. So like one of the questions I always ask is like, what trend do you not like, I want you to go in on why people shit, dude, I got my start with, with WordPress.
So like tell me your WordPress and how, uh, how much shit you take on no code Twitter. Cause I fucking hate it.
Isaac Feldman: Oh, yeah. You know, like people actually were like, Oh your son. So like, we use Webflow for everything. And like, I respect well for, I like workflow flow back to the building for a grant right now with web flow, which is awesome.
But, um, demonstrate up, I'm not stringing takes or a five third-party services to make somebody on Twitter happy. Like if I need stability for my client, and this is all part of me being, you know, like, uh, This is the business, and these are the values that I've provided. So if my client needs that kind of powerhouse, that is workers because is a powerhouse.
Like, if you need that kind of power, then I will go to WordPress. I won't think about it twice. I'm not going to go and bend with low or bent or some other tool, like in 10 different ways so I can satisfy somebody's ego so I can get a Pat on the back when I'm doing hashtag no-code like, fuck that. I'm not, I'm not like I got a responsibility, somebody paying money.
I got to
Jeremy: deliver. Right? Yeah. Like stop dude. I think, I think that's like people in no code Twitter being fucking cute. You know what I mean? Like, dude, that is the trend that I absolutely hate, which is people, patting people on the back on no code for building something completely irrelevant. It's like, great.
You rebuilt and Madden and it's like, you can't sell it. Why the fuck did you do that? To prove to people it's literally to get a Pat on the back. Do you know what I mean? That is the, literally the reason I don't like shitting on people like that. You know what I mean? Like, yeah. For me, it's all about like, WordPress is more powerful than like at, for a no-code right?
Like, dude, some people in Webflow were talking to me about dibs, dibs, like containers and shit. Right. Like whatever, I, I didn't know what the fuck they were talking about. So like, Why are you? Why, if you're talking to me in the language of code, which is, uh, which is diff, I don't know what it's not relevant to me.
Do you know what I mean? I'm a no coder. You're not a no coder. If you know what a divot is, do you see it? Do you see that disconnect?
Isaac Feldman: Yeah, absolutely. And I'm going to tell you, people were so mad. What I was saying, things like fuck, clean code or your client doesn't care about clean code. Like nobody gives a shit and people always get mad about me.
And this is not me just shitting on, on just people who write clean code that is important and don't get me wrong. There's one of the foundations of being a great engineer, but a little tip that is not a foundation to be in a great businessmen at all. Because businessmen get goals. And if I need to put 500 days in my page and it's failing, I don't give a shit.
Jeremy: Correct, dude. I go all in on that. It is no one sticks with anything that isn't making them money. You are not going to stick with building a website for a client or a customer. That isn't paying you. You're not gonna even, so the one thing I like a few people who recreate amazing things for free, they're doing it to attract customers, maybe not for them.
That's I don't get
Isaac Feldman: it. And I know exactly who you're talking about. You know, you're talking about SoCo, which is a really good friend of mine. Yeah. I
Jeremy: love SoCo. He's working for us right now. I
Isaac Feldman: respect him. He's like, he's, he's like, uh, he's like a Webflow, God. Right? Yeah. Yeah. But, but if you talk like business, there was like zero bullshit with him.
Like you can be cute within what it comes to business. Yeah. And the, and that's, and that's how you should strive. Like you should be striving to be as, as, as, as like an expert, you can build like civilization on Webflow, but at the same time, you know, you're doing that as a business strategy and not just to be to, like you said, getting a Pat on the back on Twitter.
Jeremy: Yeah, no. And he is one of the, cause he'll tell you, right? Like that it, it took him three weeks or like it took him, it didn't take him much time. It's not like he sat there for a year and did that. He's very business minded. Um, I weirdly I had a different person in mind that did that. Um, but like, because it is a one thing where someone is just like, if you ever come to me and talk in terms of like an engineer, would.
Like an engineer or a hello product person or the goals that you can recreate something it's like, terrific. But the people, you know, there's a stat out there. 96% of people in the world have no idea how to navigate a CMS, meaning they do not how to navigate. They don't know how to navigate. The backend of WordPress.
Right. But think about that. Think about how long it's been around and it's like, you think you're going to get their attention by talking dibs and containers and all that. No, man. You're not. So like that it's just all business it's getting to the minimum viable product or your V1. Right. Which is the reason why I named yeah.
Um, this is going to be great. So like, uh, I want to end on this one thing, right? The pro tip for new know coders or people getting started because like, I like you, we got along because we both did, like, I built my first dude, the first version of the one was built using a WordPress, a WooCommerce checkout.
Did it was that literally it was so it was so cool for do it. And I got it to 10, 15 K a month.
Isaac Feldman: That's so inspiring and people, I don't, I don't get like, people don't understand how fucking inspiring is that. Yeah.
Jeremy: I made a video. I may, I may, I'll send you the video. I made a video and I, um, of the V1 before I deleted the website, I was like, we had deleted that we were on flywheel or whatever, but like, uh, I'll have to send that to you, but anyway, pro tips for getting started in no-code true.
No-code uh, and no coders in the 96% of the people out there and building business models. What is your best pro tip you got? Oh,
Isaac Feldman: uh, look around the businesses around your neighborhood. Literally find out one problem that everybody's having. The other solution, knock on doors and knock on emails, right?
Because it's, COVID whatever they didn't get paid and get paid. And that's it. You know, I don't have to change the world. You don't have to build a unicorn. You don't have to do anything. You know, like if you build enough V1 or glide apps for it, for the matter. Yeah. Like for your city, you can live like a fat cat, like for good.
Jeremy: you're good. I agree. You don't need that to be like a
Isaac Feldman: unicorn,
Jeremy: right? Ah, fuck. All that. I'll do it. I'm with you, Isaac. Uh, where can people find you, man? What's your Twitter handle? Oh, so,
Isaac Feldman: uh, it's Isaac MI. So I S AAA, the, the M E they can find me at Blake code. We have the, uh, politico.com. That's the website of the agency.
And, um, yeah, you know, uh, product work.
Jeremy: I'm your guy, dude. I just followed you on Twitter. Uh, follow him on Twitter. We'll have to go back and forth. Now. That's Bly B L I C O D e.co. Check Hebrew. Oh, is it? Yeah. I love that, dude. I love you to get that. Uh, okay, Isaac, thank you so much for coming on and we'll have to have you back for sure.
Thank you, man.
Isaac Feldman: It's been a blast.
Jeremy: All right. Talk to you later. Okay.
Isaac Feldman: Bye man.