Interview with Stephen Campbell

Stephen Campbell 

Jeremy: Okay. Steven Campbell. How are you brother?

Stephen Campbell:  I'm doing well, Jeremy, thanks for having me.

Jeremy: Sometimes I feel like, uh, I got to get people to like match some energy. So I don't know what between the time I don't press the record button and then I press the record button. Um, I think for me, it's like, and that's a good framing. Yeah. I 

Stephen Campbell: was drinking too much. Your energy, your energy with all these shows here, 

Jeremy: I felt it.

I felt it. So, uh, why don't you tell her. Ruin, uh, not boring nation, uh, who Steven Campbell is and how you began your no coding little journey. 

Stephen Campbell: All right. Uh, Steven Campbell is just a young guy, very passionate, enthusiastic about creating things from thin air, you know, ideas that come to me, create them to add value to anybody.

Even myself. Funny thing is I enjoy creating mostly for myself. Well, you know what we have to make money. Right? So, uh, my background, yeah, my background is in engineering. I'm a chemical and processing engineer. Uh, and you know, I kind of felt that I needed to find more a bowl. What I loved doing without the confines of being in a particular profession.

So I kind of launched out on, on this search. To final, you know what it is I would be very good at, and this could be something I did for the next decade. So, you know, the, the, the internet became the most obvious place because, you know, I I'm in a country where everything is kind of set up. You have to apply for a job to get a good living or start a business, which I didn't want to go down that route because.

Of, you know, of how difficult it was on the hurdle. So I said maybe going online, I would find, uh, you know, something that I would be comfortable doing. So I started all with WordPress site development eventually to, you know, investing in domain names. I buy and sell domain names. That's something I still do.

And, you know, I was on to 

Jeremy: virtual ghostwriter. 

Stephen Campbell: No, no. I'll tell you. So most of the domain name investing community resides on Twitter. You know, that's where their talk was on Twitter one day. And I saw a post from a tweet from, uh, Mike had a Guild, Michael 

Jeremy: Gill. He came on the show. I love 

Stephen Campbell: Michael he's the automations guy.

Right. I wasn't following him or anything, but I just saw this in my feed. He's so he sold a no quarter related domain name for $3,500. I was like, okay, he's selling domain names, but what is no code? You know? And that's where it started for me. I started researching this hashtag and I'm seeing, you know, there are a lot of persons talking about no code and I did a Google, Google search, and I realized there was an entire movement around no code.

And that's where it kind of started for me in the no-code space. 

Jeremy: Yeah. Okay. Where are you based right now? 

Stephen Campbell: I'm based in Jamaica right now. 

Jeremy: Jamaica. All my gosh. I think about thinking about the reaches where no code gets right now. Right. So it's like, I think that's part of, one of the wonderful things. And one of the reasons why I had you on which was like, um, I think it spans the globe now, right?

Like it's becoming. A cool trend. Like you said, it started with a hashtag, are you not even knowing what no code was, but like figuring out through Michael Michael will probably love this story, but like, um, so, uh, so from there, like these, these global trends that you're seeing, what is, what is, what is a trend that you're seeing in no-code right now that you, that you enjoy seeing?

Stephen Campbell: Uh, I would say seeing persons come from, from France. From Germany, from Russia, from India, from China, from Japan, from anywhere that you can possibly think of in the world. And they're, they're, they're hanging on to no code for the future of their careers. Like I'm seeing persons taking a chance on no code and moving away from what they were doing, you know?

And that to me is very significant because. It's like they have phoned this thing that they would do. And that's the same feeling I have. So when I, I kind of get a push from these guys, uh, following no code and building with no code tools. However, the trend, I think will be short lived because I've, I've, I've been in this space and yup.

For me, I've gotten tired. Like I'm wondering where the whole do I really make money know I've made a couple dollars anting, what hole do I really make a good living from? No-code from Norcort. It's not about being on Twitter. It's not about posting. It's not about generating, you know, a large following, but it's actually in doing the work that I find valuable.

Jeremy: Steven, my man, this, this is the wrong, yeah, no fucking shortcuts, right? Like it used to see so much, dude. I think getting into the trend. I don't love, I don't love in no-code right now is like the, there is like a chin up nose in the air. Like with the people who discovered no code at the beginning, and they're creating a barrier for a new entrance, pay me 50 bucks an hour to build so that everyone can build themselves.

Yeah. Right. Like everyone should be able to build themselves. Right. So like, and I'm not, I ain't hating. On someone being able to make something a no-code and being able to pay 50 bucks an hour, I'm saying no code is so that everyone can make an app or make a website by themselves. That's the point of it?

Not so it's hard enough that, do you know what I'm saying? Here's my 

Stephen Campbell: thing. Even if someone says that, Hey, pay me this to learn how to. Uh, do this with no code. It won't last for long. That's just the, that's just the truth because renewal code in itself already democratizes ticket, it's already done. You know, you can take that back.

It's just a matter of one, someone sitting down and figuring out how to do it themselves. And I've spoken to creators that are going on YouTube and giving away the thing for free. So you might not have to spend four to eight hours learning how to do that zap or that. Yeah, it's a great show. And you might just take 15 minutes now, you know, so if I'm selling something, I have to be aware that, you know, eventually everybody will know what I am selling.


Jeremy: right. So it's constantly adapting. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. That's good. What is the trend right now that you're not accept? Like I gave you mine. What is your trend that you don't like that you're seeing in no-code? 

Stephen Campbell: Uh, the trend that I don't like seeing is how limited everybody's seeing no code. There's this?

Yeah. There's this feeling that no code is the next. Uh, crypto or the next thing, tech thing, the next tech trend, but it's not something that just started. We are calling it no code, you know, that's what we are calling it, but I realized that I have been doing no call from my WordPress days. There was a very great driving me to.

To kindness to kind of, to kind of go after whole, do I continue doing this with WordPress and even build complicated applications on WordPress? No, that wasn't possible, but that's how I was thinking, because I had no knowledge of, you know, web tool are the other tools, but the tools existed.

My limitation was not knowing what was out there. So in that sense, Persons coming into the no-code space, not knowing the potential of it and just kind of limiting it to what we see now is something I don't like. So in my mind, I was something that really caught me was no code plus AI. Right. I saw a lot of no code tools.

Um, what they were doing, what AI always did, you know, um, facial recognition, you know, conditional, uh, recognition, you know, th the things that always did, but can we use no code and think about those complicated things, those complex ideas, and actually go after that things that not existing things that don't exist to know.

My hope is to see no code. I'm reaching to persons who have raw ideas. They're non-technical they have raw ideas and we will never have the ideas that they have because they are from countries that have problems that we will never see. But with no court, they will solve those problems because they have the raw ideas.

Yeah. I agree. Yeah, no code needs to move past the limitation and be what it is supposed to be. 

Jeremy: Yeah. I liked that. I liked the, as far as reaching the globe and solve it, like mayor, like I think the limitations 

Stephen Campbell: are 

Jeremy: everywhere because like, And a merit advanced that they're talking about. Like, now you can hear me, hear 

Stephen Campbell: me.

You kind of broke up a little bit. Okay. So 

Jeremy: maybe not. I don't. So, um, the problems are like less advanced everywhere else to where the current no-code solutions can fix some of their problems. But like, I will almost go as far to say, if you haven't built in WordPress, you ain't. No. Know-how if you're just riding the wave, man.

So it's like the original OGs have all, all, remember that first time where they, they, they installed that first plugin, you know, that first WordPress plugin. So like, do you remember that empowerment, that feeling when you installed that plugin and were like, Oh shit, like I can, I can like now collect emails or I can like, do you remember where you were, what you were doing, how long ago was that?

Stephen Campbell: Uh, 2019 2018, 2019. I was, I actually did an app. I did supercharger And this was, I attempt at doing a web application for Tesla drivers to find, um, the, the nearer supercharger, uh, station within 10 kilometers. And I did that with WordPress, Mark. You. I, I had courted, uh, an Android app from scratch and I put that on the play store.

And based on the rates that it was being donated, I said, well, I need to do a wave up, but I had no clue home hold to that. I was, I was looking at, you know, um, Google cloud platform, maybe deploying some code, you know, You know that whole process, Google cloud, but it just wasn't working on. I was, uh, just wasn't technical enough.

So I did it on WordPress and I was like, Hey, maybe I could have an app business where I was building stuff on WordPress and nobody would know.

Jeremy: How did that work out?

Stephen Campbell: Because there are some things that you couldn't get done without dabbling with the, with the sort of scored. Sure. 

Jeremy: Yeah. Right. Yeah. I like that. So, um, and you mentioned how Twitter, right? Like getting your first followers or doing these, it's not about Twitter. Like how would you describe no code Twitter right now?

Stephen Campbell: I would say it can be noisy. We can move very noisy, uh, depending on who you're following and depending on how, uh, you go about your business, because for me, and I, I share this personally for me, the most important thing for me, no is not recognition or to be very popular. Right because that same thing that you spoke about that kind of nose up in the air.

We are the no code guys. We are the OGs of no code.

Okay. I felt that way as well. And that's an honest, uh, comment because instead of that, there was a circle, an inner circle, and, you know, newcomers had to, to, to work their way into that inner circle by proving themselves on Twitter. Sure. Oh yeah, yeah. That, that actually doesn't make money. So that's why I go back to saying I'm not really after being popular or being recognized.

I am looking to build a business that sustain my lifestyle for the next decade. And when I tweet. That doesn't necessarily bring me closer to that goal market there partnerships and you know, opportunities that come from being on Twitter. And I'm grateful for that. You mentioned, uh, being beyond deck, uh, I am in the no-code fellowship cohort that beyond the UCaaS.

And I would say that's an opportunity that came from being on Twitter. And I really appreciate that opportunity. I'll tell you more about it, but that's just aside from what I was doing, you know, that I wasn't looking for the opportunity. I was just building the business and then that came along. 

Jeremy: Yeah, right.

Yeah, no, I get it. So like, I love that and here's what I want to do. Um, I want to have you back on, we're going to have you back on the show. Uh, and then I would love to get you to talk about the beyond deck experience on that episode. So are you game to come back? 

Stephen Campbell: I'm there, I'm there. 

Jeremy: So, uh, w where can people find you now?

Like, what are you, what are you pushing? What's your website, your Twitter handle. So not boring nation can, uh, find out where you are. 


Stephen Campbell: right. So  is step a Campbell on the score. S T E P O C a M P B E L L. The score. And what I'm talking about mostly no is no code with AI, uh, application. I built virtual ghost completely built with bubble and open AI as GPT three.

I think I was the first one to combine them. Based on what I'm seeing online. And you know, that, that in itself has caused some kind of stir in the no-code space. And, you know, I've been talking to a few persons about that idea. Uh, so that's what I'm talking about mostly, but I have other ideas that I will talk about, you know, on Twitter and I'm on LinkedIn as well.

Jeremy: Perfect. Awesome, Steve, and thank you so much for coming on. Uh, and we're going to, I look forward to our next episode here in the next few weeks, month or so, uh, and get Jen talking about beyond deck. 

Stephen Campbell: Thanks Jeremy. Thanks for having me. Awesome. Thanks. All right. Cool. Take it easy.

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